Relax.. I don't think Threadless is racist against the American Indians. Although I agree the picture is a bit tasteless, I don't think there is any latent racism around here (especially against American Indians).

First of I completely agree that American Indians have suffered pleanty of racism, and stereo typing , it's an ugly ugly thing that people seldom recognize as the serious problem that it is.

However, I don't necesarilly think that this shirt or the people at threadless are trying to promote anything like that. If this shirt is talking about anything, it's talking about the 1950's charicaturised idea of cowboys and indians, it's not trying to be malicious, it's just pointing out a silly idea and an interesting image and sticking it on a t-shirt. As for the people in the photo, I myslef would never make the "woo-woo" sound, because I know it's a silly and wrong idea, but it's obviously just a joke to reinforce the idea of the shirt, the charectorised cowboys and indians from the 1950's and the way that little kids back then may have played the game in their backyard. If you notice, the guy in the cowboy hat has the silliest face on I've ever seen, and I'm pretty sure he's not being very acurate about swinging that rope either. Most intelligent people know that real "cowboys and indians" were never like that, and thats why the photo does not stike me as malicious racism, but a satire.

That's a fire axe and a camping hachet, I don't see any "tomahawks", I just see them doing their little act in regard to the shirt. They do this for all their shirts.

Obviously the American Indians have suffered tremendously in the past and even up until the late 80s because of greeding, disgusting human beings but I personally believe that the Threadless crew would not post an image that would offend anyone, knowingly at least, that just isn't their style. I don't think I seen too much racism on this sitre anyway, a few assholes, but that's about it.

* greeding = greedy

Do you guys come from India? Yes like Mumbay India, Bollywood?

I had to come back to this blog... this world is so consumed by hate, ignorance, greed, it's a pitiful thing to endure but at least these traits are contrasted by the compassion, love and charity of humanity.

-----------------------------------------

My first sentence in my first blog on this thread may very well be considered insentive to your concerns:

"That's a fire axe and a camping hachet, I don't see any "tomahawks", I just see them doing their little act in regard to the shirt."

but my basic point was that they weren't being serious. They are incapable of being serious!

I just need to leave this up to the Threadless crew, I'm sure when they see this blog they will conatct you but you shouldn't wait around for them to see the blog, just email them directly with your concerns.

Personally, I'm pretty easy going about these sorts of things, I don't think I have a racist or prejudiced bone in my body, but I can take a joke when I see something like this and I hate it when people are ovelyr politically correct. Then again, I guess that's easy for me to say since I'm a middle-class, white, straight male.

However, I can totally see where SanguineLghtnng is coming from, the picture reminds me of the (horribly racist) Disney version of Peter Pan and the whole "What Makes the Red Man Red?" song. Like I said above, this picture doesn't bother me a whole lot but I can see how it could bother some and I think Threadless should address SanguineLghtnng's concerns. I assume by the fact that no one from Threadless has replied here everything was sorted out via email...

I believe that the actions they are taking in the picture are NOT a claim that a)Native Americans are savages b) Native Americans of any kind have used Tomahawks, silly, colored feathers or the "woo-woo" hand-to-mouth gesture. This picture is NOT a barrage of discrimination against Native Americans. This picture does NOT criticize or belittle the Native American people, it merely harkens back to the infamous childhood game called "Cowboys and Indians" that many used to play when we were young and knew no better.

Discrimination is not the same as generalization. A generalization is merely the recognition of a prominence of a culture's characteristics. For example, a generalization that is often made is "Many Americans are fat", or "Many Jewish people are careful withtheir money", etc. These generalizations DO NOT (DO NOT) claim that EVERY SINGLE American is fat NOR that every Jewish person is careful with their money. All they are doing is acknowledging the fact that Americans tend to be fat, etc. Discrimination, however, would be the unethical treatment of other humans based on their race, religion, sex, orientation, etc.

Essentially, I do not see ANY discrimination of the great Native American people in this photograph, much less racism. I hope you will try to see the good in these people instead of making very far-fetched claims. I'm sure the staff at Threadless would be very hurt if you accused them of being racists. I understand your concern.

That's streching it. I am from American Indian ancestry, I have no problem with the t-shirt whatsoever. It seems like some people like to make these blogs just to cause controversy.

Hey I live in South Dakota!

White man came across the sea
He brought us pain and misery
He killed our tribes, he killed our creed
He took our game for his own need

We fought him hard we fought him well
Out on the plains we gave him hell
But many came too much for cree
Oh will we ever be set free?

Riding through dustclouds and barren wastes
Galloping hard on the plains
Chasing the redskins back to their holes
Fighting them at their own game
Murder for freedom a stab in the back
Women and children and cowards attack

Run to the hills run for your lives
Run to the hills run for your lives

Soldier blue on the barren wastes
Hunting and killing their game
Raping the women and wasting the men
The only good indians are tame
Selling them whisky and taking their gold
Enslaving the young and destroying the old

Run to the hills run for your lives
Run to the hills run for your lives

its a t-shirt, get over it. If you dont like it, dont buy it. Same thing with "racism" on tv... if you dont like what your seeing change the channel. You cant please everyone, theres always going to be at least one person who doesnt agree with what someone else did or is doing.

i thought the whole trite idea of 'cowboys and indians' was a little childish ond outdated for a shirt also....
don't berate this blogger because he has quite a bit of right to his opinions. he was not flaming threadless, and he knows what he is talking about.
as someone with only about 10% native american in me, i just don't like the design much as a scrawny white boy.

I'm 0% native american, 100% white boy.
I don't like the design either.
Llike Xiv siad, I won't buy it.

I don't see what the big deal is.

....Stop reading into things that aren't there.

The "Cowboy and Indians" thing has always been around, and that's all the shirt is using as refrence. And, to the poster, stop talking like you know everything about Native Americans, because it seems like your knowledge is very limited, espically when you say that non of them have ever made the "woo woo" sound. Have you talked to every since Native American ever? No. So, then don't talk without thinking.

Like I said, stop reading into things that aren't there.

As I said before I like the shirt because it does not depict anything in a derogatory manner. The Indian beat the gun-toting sheriff with a bow which can be interpereted in many ways. Natural versus industrial, elegance versus brutality, so on and so forth. On the other hand I do think that the picture that Threadless put up is pretty ignorant.

I find it fairly ridiculous that Germany can officially apologize for the Holocaust, but we can't get around to being honest about the theft of the Americas from their native inhabitants. Our history text books aren't even close to being right yet. For the most part there's a token page that can be summed up in "something happened, mistakes were made." Jesus, we can't even be square about slavery. Horrible things happened and I just don't think it's in good taste to poke fun at those things. Some have said it's insulting, I agree.

All of you people that sit at your keyboards and dismiss this thread as crockery should try to take this into perspective. American culture, even today, has taken several people's ancestry and turned it into a commerical parody. That's taking something that people find noble and majestic and perverting it into something obnoxious and trivial. Would there ever be a sports team called the Christs? Certainly not. But there are still the Cleveland Indians, the Redskins, the Braves and so on. It's easy to tell people to lighten up when it's not your identity that's being trivialized.

By the way TakenBack, not knowing anything about you I percieve from your response that you have no idea what you are talking about.

Taken Black... I am Native American and I go to Powwows and Stomp Dances and Social Gathering and never ever have I heard another Native make woo-woo sounds in all my 36 years. How old are you 12? Our songs are made with words... foreign to your ears, perhaps you should try to learn some of those words then you can tell me personally I was wrong.

Harvest Moon. I take it youre not located within a Native community or have associations with "real" Indians by your response. By the way is that your CHOSEN Indian name? Being FROM Native American ANCESTRY is not being Native American, involved in your Native community, knowing your culture and ceremonies... please don't speak on our behalf... there are too many Natives out there firghting to change the wrongs for someone with ANCESTRY to call it "controversy".

HOW is that picture racist?

get it?! HOW! (indian hello)

P.S. I own this shirt...soo funny

http://vintagevantage.com/products_new.php?productcat_id=2&product_id=279&color_id=2

Grieco... you again... the correct spelling is Hau if you're a male. Han if you're a woman... it is Lakota. HOW did you get so ignorant?

1) I speak english, and dont really care to learn how to speak or spell Lakota

2) I have nothing agianst Indians, or NAs, whatever the hell they are called nowadays...stereotypes (regarding ANY race) are funny. I have said that so many times on this site

3) Dont get your loin cloth in a bundle!!!!!!

nevermind...i guess its INDIAN according to your abreviation NDN.

no worries i'm WHT. I met a BLK guy once

I love when they shoot themselves in the foot.

what?

I have a friend who spent a summer with the Crow indians years ago and she was invited into their ceremonies because they thought she was an indian of Sioux or some other tribe, but I guess Scandinavian can pass as an indian as well. No harm done there I guess.

MrDomino,
i think that was very well said.
and i don't think the shirt is all that rasist. i mean, i think it is suppose to be some little kids memories of playing 'cowboys and indians' when they were little.
i did. well. i mean, i had little horses and little indian and cowboys toys. and the indians always won beacause they looked cooler. the stupid cowboys looked like army men.

wow that was a tanget.
i wouldn't buy the shirt, but i don't really think threadless meant to offend.

personally i like the shirt simply because some white guy got shot with an arrow in the chest! i bought the shirt for that reason! Mr. Domino has a very good point, you dont really realize the severity of something unless its happening to your race culture etc...and its true America has a tendency to exploit EVERYTHING!! take for example "cinco de mayo" its mexican independance day!! but who do you see in the restaruants and bars? do you see mexicans? yea you do but thyere serving your food cleaning your tables and singing "la cucaracha" for your own personal demise. im mexican and i might not be native american but if they find the picture tasteless i can understand why! and they have every right to be upset. thats all i have to say.

cinco de mayo is just an excuse to drink.

Umm you're mexican? Cinco de Mayo isn't Mexican Independence Day. It's the celebration of the Mexican victory over the French at Puebla in 1862.

holy shit your right mexican idependence day is september 16th man this is embarrassing. nobody look at me im soo ashammed!

Who cares when one has independence day or whatever, any date is good enough excuse to drink and celabratee!

ive got a crazy fact. people drink more on halloween than any other holiday. even st. patricks day.

ragarding the thread, i think that everyone should just stop, collaborate, and listen.

" i think that everyone should just stop, collaborate, and listen."

No, I think everybody should just open a can, tilt their head and swallow the cool honey down. Then the world peace would happen regardless of time zones.

touche.

We're all in this together.

mexicans exploit nap-time

wait, that picture isn't accurate? You mean they didn't fight in backyards wearing t-shirts and jeans, and that they really didn't hold rifles like that??? Or maybe, even, Indians don't have hair like that? Oh god...this is totally screwing up everything I ever believed.

Hehe Indians are funny.

I think it's completely ironic that the founding fathers honed the concept of a democratic government from American Indian examples and now ignorant little boys and girls use that very freedom to insult and degrade people behind the anonymity of the intarweb. Hilarious.

yeah well people are assholes on the internet, espesially 14 year olds who think they are king shit of fuck mountian.
Not having to see the faces of the people they insult and berate is perfect for pretending you actually have any smarts or guts.

This isn't about me, right?

I try to prove no points. I just say offhand things that have nothing to do with anything.

But, if it's about the others who've said things than...well okay.

Well before we had this electronic billboard, our forefathers used to write the same shit on bathroom walls.

Mmmm... Cinco de Mayo. Coronas, tacos, maybe a margarita or two. God bless you Mexico, I salute your victory!

I wasn't trying to say that I think ancient, outdated stereotypes are good, just that it's a little silly to expect perfect accuracy from a picture made by the threadless staff with whatever was on hand...a picture meant to show how t-shirts fit, not how Indians live or fight. It's supposed to be a goofy pic, not textbook material.

Would it be okay if they were in Vaudevillian blacking, chomping on watermelon and yelling "mammy" at obnoxious volume for a shirt on slavery?

I think that would be perfectly acceptable. Good thinking! Now, we are working as a team.

did you mean 'blatent' or did you really mean to say 'latent'. they mean two different things and i need clarification.

holy shit, let a sleeping dogs lie.

dont bring up a dead blog from a couple of months ago.